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¤الشبهه :
هى شبهه ضعيفه جدا وأقل من ان يرد عليها ،، ملخصها ان ملكى صادق مثل المسيح فهو ولد من عذراء وأن المسيح ولادته العذراويه ليست فريده بل ليس لها اى دلاله حتى وانه مذكور فى مخطوطات قمران*قبل الميلاد* فى سفر اخنوخ ان ملكى صادق ولادته عذراويه .———————————————————————————
الرد :
-بيعتمد الى بيقول كده على كتاب اسمه "كتابات ما بين العهدين مخطوطات قمران البحر الميت التوراة المنحول ج3" لموسى ديب الخورى ،،، وبيقتبس أن سفر اخنوخ ذكر فى الاصحاح 70 ده
-ف الاول ايه هو سفر اخنوخ ده ؟
من دائره المعارف : [سفر من الأسفار غير القانونية ويسمى أيضًا "نسخة أخنوخ الأثيوبية" أو "الحبشية" ويسمى أيضًا أخنوخ الأول. وينسب خطأ إلى أخنوخ المذكور في (تك 5: 23و24). والكتاب عبارة عن مجموعة من الأسفار اليهودية كتبت أصلًا في اللغة الأرامية على وجه الترجيح. وقد فقد الأصل الأرامي ولكن وجدت أجزاء من هذا الكتاب في الترجمة اليونانية. وكذلك توجد نسخة حبشية ترجمت عن النسخة اليونانية التي بدورها ترجمت عن الأصل الأرامي الذي يرجح أنه كتب بين سنة 163 و80 قبل الميلاد.] ،، الملخص أنه كتاب غير قانونى كتب قبل الميلاد
-الكتاب موجود فعلا فى مخطوطات قمران لكن مش مذكور اى حاجه تماما عن ده ! ف المخطوطات التى تمثل سفر اخنوخ هى : [4Q201-4Q202-4Q204-4Q205-4Q206-4Q207-4Q2012] بل مفيش اصلا فى ولا مخطوطه شابتر 70 !![راجع كتاب The Dead Sea Scrolls Translated: The Qumran Texts in English.p246:260]
سفر اخنوخ اصلا مفيهوش القصه دى !
ده الاصحاح السبعين من الكتاب
"And it came to pass after this that his name during his lifetime was raised aloft to that Son of
Man and to the Lord of Spirits from amongst those who dwell on the earth. And he was raised aloft
on the chariots of the spirit and his name vanished among them. And from that day I was no longer numbered amongst them: and he set me between the two winds, between the North and the
West, where the angels took the cords to measure for me the place for the elect and righteous. And there I saw the first fathers and the righteous who from the beginning dwell in that place."
-
[R.H. Charles,The Book of Enoch, ,1917,p92&93]
للتاكد اونلاين
https://www.httpsbible.com/Enoch/Enoch-Chapter-70.htm
https://en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Book_of_Enoch_(Charles)/Chapter_70
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/boe073.htm ]
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_النسخه المترجمه للعربيه برضه فيها نفس الكلام :
"ثم حصل ان اسم ابن الانسان هذا رفع حيا الى رب الارواح من بين سكان اليابسه ،،رفع على مركبه الريح واخذ اسمه من بينهم،، منذ هذا اليوم ماحسبت معهم، جعلتنى بين ريحين بين الشمال والغرب، حيث حمل الملائكه الحبال ليقيسوا لى الموضع للمختارين والابرار، هناك رأيت الاباء والابرار الذين يقيمون هناك منذ البدء "
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https://copticarabicbible.files.wor...8a7d8aed986d988d8ae-d983d8a7d985d984d8a71.pdf
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———————————————————————————————امال ايه حوار القصه دى ؟
-القصه فعلا موجوده لكن مش فى سفر اخنوخ لكن فى اخنوخ الثانى او اسرار اخنوخ وهو كتب بعد الميلاد وأقرب مخطوطه من القرن الخامس عشر
-القصه باختصار بتحكى كاهن اسمه نير ،،زوجته Sothonim حبلت وهى فى سن كبير على الرغم من أنها عاقر ولم يقترب منها زوجها منذ ان اصبح كاهن وحبكه دراميه كده وعلى الرغم من ده الميلاد كان بدون ذرع بشر وليس عذراوى مثل المسيح
-نص القصه
"1.And the wife of Nir, named Sopanima, being barren, brought forth no child to Nir. 2. And Sopanima was in the time of her old age, and on the day of her death she conceived in her womb, and Nir the priest did not sleep with her, nor knew her from the day that the Lord appointed him to serve before the face of the people. 3. When Sopanima knew of her conception she was ashamed, and felt humbled, and concealed herself all the days, till she brought forth, and no one of the people knew. 4. And when 282 days were accomplished and the day of birth began to draw near, Nir remembered about his wife, and called her to himself in his house, that he might talk to her. 5. And Sopanima came to Nir, her husband, being with child, and the appointed day of the birth was drawing near. 6. And Nir saw her and was very much ashamed, and said to her: 'What hast thou done, wife, and hast shamed me before the face of these people. And now depart from me, and go where thou didst commence the shame of thy womb, so that I defile not my hand upon thee, and sin before the face of the Lord!' 7. And Sopanima spake unto Nir, her husband, saying: 'My lord, lo! the time of my old age, and the day of my death has come (and there was no youth in me) and I do not know when the period of my years is past, and the unfruitfulness of my womb begin.' 8. And Nir did not believe his wife, and said to her a second time: 'Depart from me lest I do thee an injury, and sin before the face of the Lord!' 9. And it came to pass, when Nir had spoken to his wife, Sopanima feIl at the feet of Nir, and died. 10. And Nir was very much grieved, and said in his heart: 'Was this from my voice, since a man by his voice and thought sins before the face of the Lord. 11. Now the Lord is merciful to me; I know in truth in my heart, that my hand was not upon her. And so I say: "Glory to thee, oh! Lord, since no one on earth knows this deed, which the Lord has wrought!"' 12. And Nir hastened and shut the doors of the house, and went to Noe, his brother, and told him a1l, that had happened concerning his wife. 13. And Noe hastened, and came with Nir, his brother, into the house of Nir, on account of the death of Sopanima, and they talked to themselves (and saw) how her womb was at the time of the birth. 14. And Noe said to Nir: 'Let it not be a subject of sorrow to thee, Nir, my brother, that the Lord has to-day concealed our shame because no one of the people knows this. 15. Now let us go quickly, and bring her secretly, and may the Lord hide the ignominy of our shame. 16. And they laid Sopanima on the bed, and they wrapped her with black robes, and shut her in the house ready for burial, and dug a grave in secret. 17. And then came an infant from the dead Sopanima, and sat on the bed at her right hand. And Noe, and Nir entered, and saw the infant sitting by the dead Sopanima and wiping its clothes. 18. And Noe, and Nir were tempted with a great fear, for the child was complete in its body, like one of three years old; and spake with its lips, and blessed the Lord. 19. And Noe, and Nir gazed upon it; and lo! glorious in countenance. the seal of the priesthood was on its breast, and it was 20. And Noe, and Nir said 'See the Lord renews the consecration according to our blood, as he desires (this is from the Lord, my brother, and the Lord renews the blood of consecration in us).' 21. And Noe and Nir hastened, and washed the child, and clothed it in priestly raiment, and gave it the blessed bread. And it ate. And they called its name Melchizedek. 22. And Noe and Nir took the body of Sopanima, and stripped from her the black robes, and clothed her in very bright robes, and built a church for her (another house--a beautified grave). 23. And Noe, and Nir, and Melchizedek came and buried her publicly. And Noe said to his brother Nir: 'Watch this child in secret till the time, because deceitful people shall arise over aIl the earth and shall begin to reject God, and having perceived nothing shall put him to death. And then Noe went out to his own place. 24. And great lawlessness began to multiply over the whole earth, in the days of Nir. 25. And Nir began to be very anxious, especially about the child, saying: 'Woe is me, eternal Lord. In my days have begun to multiply all kinds of lawlessness upon the earth, and I understand, how that the end is near unto us more (than ever), and upon all the earth for the lawlessness of the people. 26. And now, Lord, what is the vision, and what is the solution of it, and what shall I do for (the child)?--Will it also go with us to destruction?' 27. And the Lord heard Nir, and appeared to him in a nightly vision, and said to him: 'Nir, I do not endure the great lawlessness that has been on the earth in many things, and lo! I wish now to send a great destruction upon the earth, and every earthly creature shall perish. 28. But do not trouble thyself about the child, Nir, for in a short time I will send my chief captain Michael, and he shall take the child and place him in the paradise of Eden, in the garden where Adam was formerly during a period of seven years, having the heaven always open until the time of his sin. 29. And this child shall not perish with those who perish in this generation, as I have shown, but shall be a holy priest in all things, Melchizedek, and I will appoint him that he may be the chief of the priests who were before (alia lectio--that he may be a priest of priests for ever, and I will consecrate him, and will appoint him over the people being made greatly holy). 30. And Nir rose from his sleep, and blessed the Lord, who had appeared unto him, saying: 'Blessed is the Lord God of my fathers, who has spoken unto me, (some MSS. add--who will not allow the depreciation of my priesthood in the priesthood of my fathers, as thy word), who made a great priest in my days in the womb of my wife Sopanima. (Some MSS. add-- 31. Because I had no family and this child shall be to me in the place of my family, and shall be as a on to me, and thou shalt honour him with Thy servants the priests, with Seth, and Enoch, and Tharasidam, Maleleil, aud Enos, and thy servant, and thus Melchizedek shall be a priest in another generation. 32. For I know that this generation shaIl end in confusion, and all shall perish. And Noe, my brother, shall be preserved in that day. 33. And from my race shaIl rise up many people, and Melchizedek shall be the chief of the priests among the people, ruling alone, serving thee O Lord!) 34. Because I had not another child in this family, who might be a great priest, but this son of mine, and thy servant; and do thou great Lord, on this account honour him with thy servants, and great priests--with Seth, and Enos, and Rusii, and Almilam, and Prasidam, and Maleleil, and Seroch, and Arusan, and Aleem, and Enoch, and Methusalam, and me, thy servant Nir, and Melchizedek shall be the head over twelve priests who lived before, and at last shall be the head over aIl, (being) the great high priest, the Word of God, and the power to work great and glorious marvels above aIl that have been. 35. He, Melchizedek, shall be a priest and king in the place Akhuzan, that is to say, in the middle of the earth where Adam was created: there shall at last be his grave. 36. And concerning that chief priest it has been written that he also shall be buried there, where there is the middle of the earth, as Adam buried his son Abel there whom his brother Cain killed, wherefore he lay three years unburied, till he saw a bird called a jackdaw, burying its fledgling. 37. I know that a great confusion has come and this generation shall end in confusion, and all shall perish except that Noe my brother shaIl be preserved, and afterwards there shall be a planting from his family, and there shaIl be other people, and another Melchizedek shaIl be the head of the priests among the people, ruling, and serving the Lord.'"
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[f. R. H. Charles and W. R. Morfill., The Book of the Secrets of Enoch (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1896); G. N. Bonwetsch, Das slavische Henochbuch (AGWG, 1; Berlin, 1896).]
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لكن المفاجاه انة القصه دى مش اصيله اصلا لكن مضافه :-D
بيقول Charles & Morfill& Bonwetsch
ان القصه كانت مذيله ومكانتش فى النص الرئيسى
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[Cf. R. H. Charles and W. R. Morfill., The Book of the Secrets of Enoch (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1896); G. N. Bonwetsch, Das slavische Henochbuch (AGWG, 1; Berlin, 1896).]
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حتى Fred Horton الدارس لتقليد ملكى صادق تجاهل قصه اخنوخ الثانى فى كتابه وقال انها غير معتمد عليها
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[Horton, The Melchizedek Tradition]
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~~ غباء ناقد
-الحاجه المثيرة للسخريه ان طارح الشبهه لم يقرأ الكتاب الى اقتبس منه من الاساس ! :-D
-كتاب اخنوخ الثانى كتب بعد الميلاد فبالتالى هو ليس ضمن مخطوطات قمران اطلاقا ،، الكتاب المقتبس منه هو ترجمه لكتاب فرنسى اسمه La Bible, écrits intertestamentaires "الكتاب المقدس كتابات مابين العهدين" بمعنى أن الكتاب بيتحدث عن الكتب الابوكريفيه والغير قانونيه وليس المذكورة فى مخطوطات قمرنا تحديدا وقد ترجم منه نفس الكاتب اجزاء أخرى من كتابه فى مواضيع غير متعلقه بمخطوطات قمران بل ان الكاتب نفسه فى مقدمه الكتاب يعترف ان الكتب الوارد ذكرها ليست فى مخطوطات قمران اصلا !
-السفر المذكور فى الكتاب ليس اخنوخ الاول لكن اخنوخ الثانى وهذا مااثبتناه ومااكده كاتب الكتاب
-------
الملخص :
1: اطرح الشيهه لم يقراء اصلا فقط يقتبس عشوائيا لخداع من ليس لهم علم
2: الولاده بدون زرع بشر وليست عذراويه
3: مذكورة فى سفر اخنوخ الثانى بعد الميلاد وليس اخنوخ الاول قبل الميلاد
4: ليس لها اى وجود فى مخطوطات قمران
5:سواء كانت فى اخنوخ الاول او الثانى ف ذلك لايفرق فى اى شئ فهى اسفار غير قانونيه اى ليست ضمن اسفار كتابنا المقدس المعترف بها
leasantr
هى شبهه ضعيفه جدا وأقل من ان يرد عليها ،، ملخصها ان ملكى صادق مثل المسيح فهو ولد من عذراء وأن المسيح ولادته العذراويه ليست فريده بل ليس لها اى دلاله حتى وانه مذكور فى مخطوطات قمران*قبل الميلاد* فى سفر اخنوخ ان ملكى صادق ولادته عذراويه .———————————————————————————
الرد :
-بيعتمد الى بيقول كده على كتاب اسمه "كتابات ما بين العهدين مخطوطات قمران البحر الميت التوراة المنحول ج3" لموسى ديب الخورى ،،، وبيقتبس أن سفر اخنوخ ذكر فى الاصحاح 70 ده
-ف الاول ايه هو سفر اخنوخ ده ؟
من دائره المعارف : [سفر من الأسفار غير القانونية ويسمى أيضًا "نسخة أخنوخ الأثيوبية" أو "الحبشية" ويسمى أيضًا أخنوخ الأول. وينسب خطأ إلى أخنوخ المذكور في (تك 5: 23و24). والكتاب عبارة عن مجموعة من الأسفار اليهودية كتبت أصلًا في اللغة الأرامية على وجه الترجيح. وقد فقد الأصل الأرامي ولكن وجدت أجزاء من هذا الكتاب في الترجمة اليونانية. وكذلك توجد نسخة حبشية ترجمت عن النسخة اليونانية التي بدورها ترجمت عن الأصل الأرامي الذي يرجح أنه كتب بين سنة 163 و80 قبل الميلاد.] ،، الملخص أنه كتاب غير قانونى كتب قبل الميلاد
-الكتاب موجود فعلا فى مخطوطات قمران لكن مش مذكور اى حاجه تماما عن ده ! ف المخطوطات التى تمثل سفر اخنوخ هى : [4Q201-4Q202-4Q204-4Q205-4Q206-4Q207-4Q2012] بل مفيش اصلا فى ولا مخطوطه شابتر 70 !![راجع كتاب The Dead Sea Scrolls Translated: The Qumran Texts in English.p246:260]
سفر اخنوخ اصلا مفيهوش القصه دى !
ده الاصحاح السبعين من الكتاب
"And it came to pass after this that his name during his lifetime was raised aloft to that Son of
Man and to the Lord of Spirits from amongst those who dwell on the earth. And he was raised aloft
on the chariots of the spirit and his name vanished among them. And from that day I was no longer numbered amongst them: and he set me between the two winds, between the North and the
West, where the angels took the cords to measure for me the place for the elect and righteous. And there I saw the first fathers and the righteous who from the beginning dwell in that place."
-
[R.H. Charles,The Book of Enoch, ,1917,p92&93]
للتاكد اونلاين
https://www.httpsbible.com/Enoch/Enoch-Chapter-70.htm
https://en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Book_of_Enoch_(Charles)/Chapter_70
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/boe073.htm ]
-
_النسخه المترجمه للعربيه برضه فيها نفس الكلام :
"ثم حصل ان اسم ابن الانسان هذا رفع حيا الى رب الارواح من بين سكان اليابسه ،،رفع على مركبه الريح واخذ اسمه من بينهم،، منذ هذا اليوم ماحسبت معهم، جعلتنى بين ريحين بين الشمال والغرب، حيث حمل الملائكه الحبال ليقيسوا لى الموضع للمختارين والابرار، هناك رأيت الاباء والابرار الذين يقيمون هناك منذ البدء "
-
https://copticarabicbible.files.wor...8a7d8aed986d988d8ae-d983d8a7d985d984d8a71.pdf
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———————————————————————————————امال ايه حوار القصه دى ؟
-القصه فعلا موجوده لكن مش فى سفر اخنوخ لكن فى اخنوخ الثانى او اسرار اخنوخ وهو كتب بعد الميلاد وأقرب مخطوطه من القرن الخامس عشر
-القصه باختصار بتحكى كاهن اسمه نير ،،زوجته Sothonim حبلت وهى فى سن كبير على الرغم من أنها عاقر ولم يقترب منها زوجها منذ ان اصبح كاهن وحبكه دراميه كده وعلى الرغم من ده الميلاد كان بدون ذرع بشر وليس عذراوى مثل المسيح
-نص القصه
"1.And the wife of Nir, named Sopanima, being barren, brought forth no child to Nir. 2. And Sopanima was in the time of her old age, and on the day of her death she conceived in her womb, and Nir the priest did not sleep with her, nor knew her from the day that the Lord appointed him to serve before the face of the people. 3. When Sopanima knew of her conception she was ashamed, and felt humbled, and concealed herself all the days, till she brought forth, and no one of the people knew. 4. And when 282 days were accomplished and the day of birth began to draw near, Nir remembered about his wife, and called her to himself in his house, that he might talk to her. 5. And Sopanima came to Nir, her husband, being with child, and the appointed day of the birth was drawing near. 6. And Nir saw her and was very much ashamed, and said to her: 'What hast thou done, wife, and hast shamed me before the face of these people. And now depart from me, and go where thou didst commence the shame of thy womb, so that I defile not my hand upon thee, and sin before the face of the Lord!' 7. And Sopanima spake unto Nir, her husband, saying: 'My lord, lo! the time of my old age, and the day of my death has come (and there was no youth in me) and I do not know when the period of my years is past, and the unfruitfulness of my womb begin.' 8. And Nir did not believe his wife, and said to her a second time: 'Depart from me lest I do thee an injury, and sin before the face of the Lord!' 9. And it came to pass, when Nir had spoken to his wife, Sopanima feIl at the feet of Nir, and died. 10. And Nir was very much grieved, and said in his heart: 'Was this from my voice, since a man by his voice and thought sins before the face of the Lord. 11. Now the Lord is merciful to me; I know in truth in my heart, that my hand was not upon her. And so I say: "Glory to thee, oh! Lord, since no one on earth knows this deed, which the Lord has wrought!"' 12. And Nir hastened and shut the doors of the house, and went to Noe, his brother, and told him a1l, that had happened concerning his wife. 13. And Noe hastened, and came with Nir, his brother, into the house of Nir, on account of the death of Sopanima, and they talked to themselves (and saw) how her womb was at the time of the birth. 14. And Noe said to Nir: 'Let it not be a subject of sorrow to thee, Nir, my brother, that the Lord has to-day concealed our shame because no one of the people knows this. 15. Now let us go quickly, and bring her secretly, and may the Lord hide the ignominy of our shame. 16. And they laid Sopanima on the bed, and they wrapped her with black robes, and shut her in the house ready for burial, and dug a grave in secret. 17. And then came an infant from the dead Sopanima, and sat on the bed at her right hand. And Noe, and Nir entered, and saw the infant sitting by the dead Sopanima and wiping its clothes. 18. And Noe, and Nir were tempted with a great fear, for the child was complete in its body, like one of three years old; and spake with its lips, and blessed the Lord. 19. And Noe, and Nir gazed upon it; and lo! glorious in countenance. the seal of the priesthood was on its breast, and it was 20. And Noe, and Nir said 'See the Lord renews the consecration according to our blood, as he desires (this is from the Lord, my brother, and the Lord renews the blood of consecration in us).' 21. And Noe and Nir hastened, and washed the child, and clothed it in priestly raiment, and gave it the blessed bread. And it ate. And they called its name Melchizedek. 22. And Noe and Nir took the body of Sopanima, and stripped from her the black robes, and clothed her in very bright robes, and built a church for her (another house--a beautified grave). 23. And Noe, and Nir, and Melchizedek came and buried her publicly. And Noe said to his brother Nir: 'Watch this child in secret till the time, because deceitful people shall arise over aIl the earth and shall begin to reject God, and having perceived nothing shall put him to death. And then Noe went out to his own place. 24. And great lawlessness began to multiply over the whole earth, in the days of Nir. 25. And Nir began to be very anxious, especially about the child, saying: 'Woe is me, eternal Lord. In my days have begun to multiply all kinds of lawlessness upon the earth, and I understand, how that the end is near unto us more (than ever), and upon all the earth for the lawlessness of the people. 26. And now, Lord, what is the vision, and what is the solution of it, and what shall I do for (the child)?--Will it also go with us to destruction?' 27. And the Lord heard Nir, and appeared to him in a nightly vision, and said to him: 'Nir, I do not endure the great lawlessness that has been on the earth in many things, and lo! I wish now to send a great destruction upon the earth, and every earthly creature shall perish. 28. But do not trouble thyself about the child, Nir, for in a short time I will send my chief captain Michael, and he shall take the child and place him in the paradise of Eden, in the garden where Adam was formerly during a period of seven years, having the heaven always open until the time of his sin. 29. And this child shall not perish with those who perish in this generation, as I have shown, but shall be a holy priest in all things, Melchizedek, and I will appoint him that he may be the chief of the priests who were before (alia lectio--that he may be a priest of priests for ever, and I will consecrate him, and will appoint him over the people being made greatly holy). 30. And Nir rose from his sleep, and blessed the Lord, who had appeared unto him, saying: 'Blessed is the Lord God of my fathers, who has spoken unto me, (some MSS. add--who will not allow the depreciation of my priesthood in the priesthood of my fathers, as thy word), who made a great priest in my days in the womb of my wife Sopanima. (Some MSS. add-- 31. Because I had no family and this child shall be to me in the place of my family, and shall be as a on to me, and thou shalt honour him with Thy servants the priests, with Seth, and Enoch, and Tharasidam, Maleleil, aud Enos, and thy servant, and thus Melchizedek shall be a priest in another generation. 32. For I know that this generation shaIl end in confusion, and all shall perish. And Noe, my brother, shall be preserved in that day. 33. And from my race shaIl rise up many people, and Melchizedek shall be the chief of the priests among the people, ruling alone, serving thee O Lord!) 34. Because I had not another child in this family, who might be a great priest, but this son of mine, and thy servant; and do thou great Lord, on this account honour him with thy servants, and great priests--with Seth, and Enos, and Rusii, and Almilam, and Prasidam, and Maleleil, and Seroch, and Arusan, and Aleem, and Enoch, and Methusalam, and me, thy servant Nir, and Melchizedek shall be the head over twelve priests who lived before, and at last shall be the head over aIl, (being) the great high priest, the Word of God, and the power to work great and glorious marvels above aIl that have been. 35. He, Melchizedek, shall be a priest and king in the place Akhuzan, that is to say, in the middle of the earth where Adam was created: there shall at last be his grave. 36. And concerning that chief priest it has been written that he also shall be buried there, where there is the middle of the earth, as Adam buried his son Abel there whom his brother Cain killed, wherefore he lay three years unburied, till he saw a bird called a jackdaw, burying its fledgling. 37. I know that a great confusion has come and this generation shall end in confusion, and all shall perish except that Noe my brother shaIl be preserved, and afterwards there shall be a planting from his family, and there shaIl be other people, and another Melchizedek shaIl be the head of the priests among the people, ruling, and serving the Lord.'"
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[f. R. H. Charles and W. R. Morfill., The Book of the Secrets of Enoch (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1896); G. N. Bonwetsch, Das slavische Henochbuch (AGWG, 1; Berlin, 1896).]
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لكن المفاجاه انة القصه دى مش اصيله اصلا لكن مضافه :-D
بيقول Charles & Morfill& Bonwetsch
ان القصه كانت مذيله ومكانتش فى النص الرئيسى
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[Cf. R. H. Charles and W. R. Morfill., The Book of the Secrets of Enoch (Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1896); G. N. Bonwetsch, Das slavische Henochbuch (AGWG, 1; Berlin, 1896).]
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حتى Fred Horton الدارس لتقليد ملكى صادق تجاهل قصه اخنوخ الثانى فى كتابه وقال انها غير معتمد عليها
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[Horton, The Melchizedek Tradition]
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~~ غباء ناقد
-الحاجه المثيرة للسخريه ان طارح الشبهه لم يقرأ الكتاب الى اقتبس منه من الاساس ! :-D
-كتاب اخنوخ الثانى كتب بعد الميلاد فبالتالى هو ليس ضمن مخطوطات قمران اطلاقا ،، الكتاب المقتبس منه هو ترجمه لكتاب فرنسى اسمه La Bible, écrits intertestamentaires "الكتاب المقدس كتابات مابين العهدين" بمعنى أن الكتاب بيتحدث عن الكتب الابوكريفيه والغير قانونيه وليس المذكورة فى مخطوطات قمرنا تحديدا وقد ترجم منه نفس الكاتب اجزاء أخرى من كتابه فى مواضيع غير متعلقه بمخطوطات قمران بل ان الكاتب نفسه فى مقدمه الكتاب يعترف ان الكتب الوارد ذكرها ليست فى مخطوطات قمران اصلا !
-السفر المذكور فى الكتاب ليس اخنوخ الاول لكن اخنوخ الثانى وهذا مااثبتناه ومااكده كاتب الكتاب
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الملخص :
1: اطرح الشيهه لم يقراء اصلا فقط يقتبس عشوائيا لخداع من ليس لهم علم
2: الولاده بدون زرع بشر وليست عذراويه
3: مذكورة فى سفر اخنوخ الثانى بعد الميلاد وليس اخنوخ الاول قبل الميلاد
4: ليس لها اى وجود فى مخطوطات قمران
5:سواء كانت فى اخنوخ الاول او الثانى ف ذلك لايفرق فى اى شئ فهى اسفار غير قانونيه اى ليست ضمن اسفار كتابنا المقدس المعترف بها
leasantr
التعديل الأخير بواسطة المشرف:
